|
Post by Fumbduckery on Feb 7, 2022 19:34:27 GMT -5
I can guarantee I wont be watching games if that combination of events happens.
We've always been against keeping players with character issues, we should not let money dictate a change in that philosophy. We took a beating in the Hector Olivera situation, we should not change our thinking just because of money. And I don't want anyone to say yeah, but Ozuna is a better player than Olivera. That shouldn't enter into it. You draw the same line for character for all of your players.
Olivera was hit with a misdemeanor charge for assault and battery. Ozuna was originally slapped with two felony charges. Which eventually magically were dropped. And now the judge is announcing that the misdemeanor charge Ozuna is facing will be dropped if he completes a 6 month program. And that will be dropped to a 3 month program if he completes everything within the three month period. So how does one go about completing a 6 month program in 3 months? It's 6 months for a reason. Jesus.
For comparison, we traded Olivera on July 30th, 2016 and he was convicted on September 8th. We didn't wait around to see if he was found guilty or not. Why would this philosophy change now? We should do the same thing we did before, we find a bad contract somewhere else, and we take the hit and we move on. Ozuna would actually be pretty easy to trade because a few teams will be willing to look past his character and take a chance that he'll bounce back as a player.
So........if the Braves were to keep Ozuna (I don't think they will, and hope they don't because of the bad publicity if nothing else), you'll just turn off a lifetime of rooting for a team that easily? What if he really has changed? People make mistakes, man. After all, he's a very young man, and young men tend to be more temperamental than us old farts. You do remember that Bobby Cox was involved in a similar situation at a much older age, don't you? Why is his case different from Ozuna's? I mean, he was the manager, for chrissakes. How much punishment is enough for Ozuna? Don't get me wrong, I'm not defending him at all, just curious what your thoughts are. No I never said I'd stop rooting for our team. I said I wouldn't watch the games, there's a big difference. IF the combination of Ozuna staying and Freddie leaving happened. Truth be told I may not be watching the games even if Freddie stays and Ozuna goes, because I have so many projects in front of me. I did say earlier I would not root for Ozuna, but I would still root for the team overall as much as I ever have.
I do believe people can turn their lives around and overcome problems, but things like this are a process. You can't flip a switch and prove within one year you've changed. And why didn't we give Olivera a chance to do that?
I was never a Bobby Cox fan so that's out the window.......I feel like he was great at evaluating talent, a great cheerleader and a really poor X's and O's guy. I think he cost us a few times with his managerial decisions, and moreso with his never ending loyalty to the players that were his guys. To a fault. For the record, he was a way better X's and O's guy than Snitker in my opinion. I do feel like Bobby did a lot for the success that we DID have, but if he had been fired after the domestic abuse I would have agreed with it and been fine with it. I remember that it did not sit well with me when it all was brushed under the rug, but since I didn't like him as a manager I figured I might have been biased against him.
I grew up in a very vocally demeaning family with some violence during my teen years, and I never participated. There was something in my make up that let me just turn a cold shoulder to it, take it when it was directed at me and walk away. My attitude has always been walk away, even if it's just verbal. I think at times maybe I'm too hard on people in general who can't do that. Maybe I'm just lucky that I could always do that. But to me when you're stupid enough to stay in a relationship, even if it's just verbal abuse, then you don't have much of an argument in my opinion. There's where I've been with Ozuna. That garbage went on for a long time in that house and he should have walked away before it went too far.
|
|
|
Post by Fumbduckery on Feb 7, 2022 19:42:39 GMT -5
The other thing that would really piss me off is if we keep Ozuna and then don't sign Rosario because we don't have the money. We need to reward the guy who actually played a huge role in us winning the World Series and dump the guy who made things really hard for us.
Rosario is not a fly by night one hit wonder, he's had some really solid seasons and we should make him a huge priority. It likely will be a really big financial kick in the nads for us to do that, but we made a ton winning the World Series and we should expect to be making a lot of cash via playoff baseball for the next several years.
Think about how much money Rosario just made for himself after the trade deadline. The Twins DFA'd him after 2020 and let him walk away with nothing in return. That was really stupid and I don't get it, but it did happen.
|
|
|
Post by keystone61 on Feb 8, 2022 8:59:32 GMT -5
So............game 7 of the World Series is on the line, tie game bottom of the 9th, 2 outs, runner on 2nd, you're not pulling for Ozuna to get a hit? You're not watching?
I'm more in the "it ain't my call, I'll root for the guys the Braves send out there" school of thought.
We'll never know the full details of what happened between him and his wife. I do know this......if I came home and found texts of a sexual nature on my wife's phone (which was what happened, IIRC), I'd be PISSED. I'm 60 years old and would like to think I could walk away, but I don't wanna be put in that situation. I am a man, and I do have my weaknesses and limits.
Furthermore, have we seen any photos of her bruised and battered face and/or body, or did he just push her against a wall once and threaten to kill her? AGAIN, I AM NOT EXCUSING THAT OR ANY BEHAVIOR ON OZUNA'S PART, I am only saying that we are all human and that I haven't seen any evidence of a beating other than the short video clip.
My wife works in DV, and they always take LOTS and LOTS of pictures of bruises, scratches, etc., ALL OVER THE VICTIM'S BODY. Why haven't we seen any of that? Do these things not exist, or is Ozuna's wife not allowing that ot be released because of the $$$ the man has (I tend to think the latter). Again, we will never know. I'm just not willing to play judge, jury, and executioner, that's all. You're bringing your experiences and prejudices into this and letting it cloud your judgement, IMO. AGAIN, I AM NOT EXCUSING THAT OR ANY BEHAVIOR ON OZUNA'S PART. Just making observations. You know I think you're a good dude and that I enjoy your posts and observations.
|
|
|
Post by PABraveFan on Feb 8, 2022 9:49:14 GMT -5
"So............game 7 of the World Series is on the line, tie game bottom of the 9th, 2 outs, runner on 2nd, you're not pulling for Ozuna to get a hit? You're not watching?" Rooting for a strike out and wild pitch for 1st and 3rd and then a balk!
BRAVES WIN!!! BRAVES WIN!!! LOL
|
|
|
Post by Fumbduckery on Feb 8, 2022 10:22:40 GMT -5
So............game 7 of the World Series is on the line, tie game bottom of the 9th, 2 outs, runner on 2nd, you're not pulling for Ozuna to get a hit? You're not watching? I'm more in the "it ain't my call, I'll root for the guys the Braves send out there" school of thought. We'll never know the full details of what happened between him and his wife. I do know this......if I came home and found texts of a sexual nature on my wife's phone (which was what happened, IIRC), I'd be PISSED. I'm 60 years old and would like to think I could walk away, but I don't wanna be put in that situation. I am a man, and I do have my weaknesses and limits. Furthermore, have we seen any photos of her bruised and battered face and/or body, or did he just push her against a wall once and threaten to kill her? AGAIN, I AM NOT EXCUSING THAT OR ANY BEHAVIOR ON OZUNA'S PART, I am only saying that we are all human and that I haven't seen any evidence of a beating other than the short video clip. My wife works in DV, and they always take LOTS and LOTS of pictures of bruises, scratches, etc., ALL OVER THE VICTIM'S BODY. Why haven't we seen any of that? Do these things not exist, or is Ozuna's wife not allowing that ot be released because of the $$$ the man has (I tend to think the latter). Again, we will never know. I'm just not willing to play judge, jury, and executioner, that's all. You're bringing your experiences and prejudices into this and letting it cloud your judgement, IMO. AGAIN, I AM NOT EXCUSING THAT OR ANY BEHAVIOR ON OZUNA'S PART. Just making observations. You know I think you're a good dude and that I enjoy your posts and observations. All fair points. Again, did we give this kind of consideration to Olivera? When it comes to all of this I also have a huge personal problem with people who have a lot of money getting off Scott free in situations where the average person wouldn’t. I am biased and I won’t deny it. I’m not looking at this as if I’m sitting on a jury, I’m just going by who I want on my baseball team. One of the issues we have is that we never get any of the actual details like we would if we were on a jury. So the best I can do is based on the power of testosterone and the general alpha attitude that comes with making it in a pro sport, probably a third of the guys in baseball are in volatile relationships and manage to avoid police calls and media reports, so I’m going to be very critical of the guy that can’t do that. Sure we don’t know details, but this wasn’t a one day event, this went on for years so he had plenty of opportunities to get out of it before things got to this point. They were supposed to be getting a divorce, so if he saw sexual pictures on her phone so what, and why is he even looking at her phone since they were splitting up? If they were, there’s a 100% he was getting some somewhere else too, so what’s the issue?
|
|
|
Post by Fumbduckery on Feb 8, 2022 10:26:13 GMT -5
"So............game 7 of the World Series is on the line, tie game bottom of the 9th, 2 outs, runner on 2nd, you're not pulling for Ozuna to get a hit? You're not watching?" Rooting for a strike out and wild pitch for 1st and 3rd and then a balk!
BRAVES WIN!!! BRAVES WIN!!! LOL Nice! I’d root for a bases loaded HBP. 🤨
|
|
|
Post by keystone61 on Feb 8, 2022 10:35:45 GMT -5
So............game 7 of the World Series is on the line, tie game bottom of the 9th, 2 outs, runner on 2nd, you're not pulling for Ozuna to get a hit? You're not watching? I'm more in the "it ain't my call, I'll root for the guys the Braves send out there" school of thought. We'll never know the full details of what happened between him and his wife. I do know this......if I came home and found texts of a sexual nature on my wife's phone (which was what happened, IIRC), I'd be PISSED. I'm 60 years old and would like to think I could walk away, but I don't wanna be put in that situation. I am a man, and I do have my weaknesses and limits. Furthermore, have we seen any photos of her bruised and battered face and/or body, or did he just push her against a wall once and threaten to kill her? AGAIN, I AM NOT EXCUSING THAT OR ANY BEHAVIOR ON OZUNA'S PART, I am only saying that we are all human and that I haven't seen any evidence of a beating other than the short video clip. My wife works in DV, and they always take LOTS and LOTS of pictures of bruises, scratches, etc., ALL OVER THE VICTIM'S BODY. Why haven't we seen any of that? Do these things not exist, or is Ozuna's wife not allowing that ot be released because of the $$$ the man has (I tend to think the latter). Again, we will never know. I'm just not willing to play judge, jury, and executioner, that's all. You're bringing your experiences and prejudices into this and letting it cloud your judgement, IMO. AGAIN, I AM NOT EXCUSING THAT OR ANY BEHAVIOR ON OZUNA'S PART. Just making observations. You know I think you're a good dude and that I enjoy your posts and observations. All fair points. Again, did we give this kind of consideration to Olivera? When it comes to all of this I also have a huge personal problem with people who have a lot of money getting off Scott free in situations where the average person wouldn’t. I am biased and I won’t deny it. I’m not looking at this as if I’m sitting on a jury, I’m just going by who I want on my baseball team. One of the issues we have is that we never get any of the actual details like we would if we were on a jury. So the best I can do is based on the power of testosterone and the general alpha attitude that comes with making it in a pro sport, probably a third of the guys in baseball are in volatile relationships and manage to avoid police calls and media reports, so I’m going to be very critical of the guy that can’t do that. Sure we don’t know details, but this wasn’t a one day event, this went on for years so he had plenty of opportunities to get out of it before things got to this point. They were supposed to be getting a divorce, so if he saw sexual pictures on her phone so what, and why is he even looking at her phone since they were splitting up? If they were, there’s a 100% he was getting some somewhere else too, so what’s the issue? You're right about it happening before, but you can't apply reason to relationships, especially toxic relationships. I don't want him on the Braves, either..........just for the record.
|
|
|
Post by Fumbduckery on Feb 8, 2022 15:13:35 GMT -5
The reason I’m especially against Ozuna was because it went on for so long. To the point he had called the police on her like two years ago for hitting him in the face with a soap dish or something. When something goes on for years there’s more than plenty of time for reason to sink in and take over. I know sometimes both people thrive on turmoil, but when you do that, you deserve any bad things that come out of it. We should all be well aware that by the time we’re adults. It can be fun to be in an electric relationship, but if it’s going too far on the bad side and someone stays in it, I don’t have any sympathy for anything bad that happens to them. I did see his hand around her throat when they first opened that door, and I don’t care if it was just there for half a second, that’s a guy who should be doing jail time and losing his $54M contract. And that’s what would happen to an average mook like us. We shouldn’t let him all the way off the hook. He needs to go somewhere else and start over and prove he’s a different person now. He let us down big time last year, he needs to move on.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 8, 2022 15:38:52 GMT -5
I am more in the camp that I would prefer to move Ozuna for another bad contract (if it can be done)
But, as keystone says, its not my call, and I will root for whomever the Braves send up there. If you absolutely have to have him on the roster I will hope he can perform. The better he performs the better possibility he can be trade bait.
I do not have to love the guy to hope he performs.
Now, lets say if Freddie does leave and they have the chance to move Ozuna for say, a guy like Eric Hosmer who has 4 yrs left on a bad contract I will not love it but will tolerate it.
For one thing, after next yr, Hosmer is scheduled to make $13 mil per for the last 3 yrs of his deal. If he can hit like a league average hitter (which he has been during this contract) 13 mil per is not the worst contract in the world. And it gives us time to develop a young first baseman.
It will suck to go to plan B , C or whatever plan but the business of this game often sucks anyway. My first choice is to keep FF and would prefer to move on from Ozuna but is it feasable to move him right now. For now we have no idea when we will be able to see moves made.
This is a most unusual off season where nothing can be done (for now) and I am assuming it will start late
I cannot think of another off season like this when it was fast and furious up to December 1st than well - you know the story.
|
|
|
Post by Fumbduckery on Feb 8, 2022 16:37:23 GMT -5
I'd love to know how the players really feel about Ozuna. I think it was telling that not one of them ever said a single word about him after he went out last year. And they immediately dropped all the hand signs he was using when he got on base. I have a feeling they were universally pissed off and felt let down. If he comes back, I'm sure we'll here the standard expected comments from everybody and they'll act like everything is cool. But it will be interesting to see if it causes any issues with the team chemistry--that thing is so important and elusive, and we have it. If the guys still feel ill towards him and hide it that could be an issue. One of the reasons we shouldn't take a chance.
I'd have every player submit in computer print their true feelings about it without putting their names on it. If you ask them face to face or in a group they're all going to act like it's all good if Ozuna stays. But I'd do it my way to let them know their opinions matter, because to me that's what matters the most if you're going to consider keeping him.
|
|
|
Post by PABraveFan on Feb 11, 2022 22:05:56 GMT -5
Batting Around: Will Freddie Freeman actually leave the Braves after MLB lockout ends?
|
|
|
Post by PABraveFan on Feb 25, 2022 19:27:02 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by SuperBrave on Mar 11, 2022 12:27:11 GMT -5
PAY THE MAN!
|
|