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Post by joeyg39 on Feb 21, 2023 9:03:53 GMT -5
Gaylord Perry from 1969 to 1975 averaged close to 27 complete games a season. 27! In the same time span he averaged 340 innings pitched per season as well..
By comparison, Sandy Alcantara led the league with an unheard of, by today's standards, 6CG's and 228 innings pitched.
The other nite I just watched game 7 of the 92 Braves/Pirates game. Doug Drabek came out to pitch the 9th inning after already throwing 120 pitches.
I can guarantee you that Perry probably didn't pick up a baseball after the season ended and before spring training started. By contrast, pitchers today have an off-season conditioning program second to none with state of the art facilities. Specialized trainers. Nutrition specialists. Sports psychologists. And by comparison to 40 or 50 years ago can't even begin to put up the numbers of previous pitchers of that era. It's incredible when you think about it.
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Post by Fumbduckery on Feb 21, 2023 10:00:33 GMT -5
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Post by Fumbduckery on Feb 21, 2023 10:14:31 GMT -5
IMO I would think hitters have to be gaining on hitting high velocity. When you see 95+ as much as they do at some point they’ll be used to it. Then what, as far as the pitchers go?
Imagine if baseball does something asinine like move the mound back five feet, like they’ve discussed, and completely eliminate any advantage at all from velocity. I would think you’d have to start teaching guys how to actually pitch again. And at that point wouldn’t it make sense to raise pitch counts too? I’m not even sure you could take a 27 year old pitcher who has been under a 75 pitch count limit since he was a kid and stretch him out.
At some point common sense has to come back into play with how pitchers are being conditioned and used.
I’m afraid one way the problem might be addressed by MLB is changing games to only be 7 innings long. It would fit the way pitchers are used and shorten the length of the game, something that seems to be priority number one to MLB. And it’s being done to try to appease casual fans who aren’t really dedicated to the game at all.
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Post by joeyg39 on Feb 21, 2023 12:15:46 GMT -5
Changing major components of the game to increase interest ($$$)... is absurd. Hockey did it with the two line pass...icing...overtime. With success you could argue. Didn't think I would like that, but tbh, I do. It highlights talent, speed and skill.
MLB on the other hand shouldn't tamper with the major components of the game more than they already have. It will become unrecognizable.The longball, strikeouts and base stealing should be emphasized. Small ball, a la Herzog, is a thing of the past unfortunately.
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Post by keystone61 on Feb 21, 2023 23:25:12 GMT -5
There’s pretty good evidence that’s true. As time goes by and the more they baby these guys the more arm trouble they have. For some it may just be pushing max velocity. It will be interesting to see who the first one is to go back to old school philosophy and stretch them out to 130 pitches and pitching rather than trying to throw 100 mph. I hope it's the Braves. My son plays and he's having to make a big adjustment. He can hit the hard throwers (75ish mph) like a champ, but he flails at soft tossing kids. Point being, good off speed is hard to hit. The same thing would probably happen in the majors. Go back and watch some vintage Greg Maddux. Lots of fastballs, all moving in different directions, and insane command. He was never injured that I recall, and if he was, it was minor. He was an artist. People wonder why the Braves don't sign pitchers to long term deals. The answer? Because they're smart. |
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Post by Fumbduckery on Feb 22, 2023 1:51:29 GMT -5
There’s pretty good evidence that’s true. As time goes by and the more they baby these guys the more arm trouble they have. For some it may just be pushing max velocity. It will be interesting to see who the first one is to go back to old school philosophy and stretch them out to 130 pitches and pitching rather than trying to throw 100 mph. I hope it's the Braves. My son plays and he's having to make a big adjustment. He can hit the hard throwers (75ish mph) like a champ, but he flails at soft tossing kids. Point being, good off speed is hard to hit. The same thing would probably happen in the majors. Go back and watch some vintage Greg Maddux. Lots of fastballs, all moving in different directions, and insane command. He was never injured that I recall, and if he was, it was minor. He was an artist. People wonder why the Braves don't sign pitchers to long term deals. The answer? Because they're smart. The eye test tells us if a guy can throw 90-92 mph and hit 94 mph when he wants to reach back, he can throw the ball by major league hitters if he knows how to pitch. Keeping hitters off balance and making the pitches all look similar on their way to the plate is enough to throw hitters off and get smoked. The problem is there are not really many pitchers in the big leagues who are very smart anymore. |
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Post by keystone61 on Feb 22, 2023 10:40:23 GMT -5
I hope it's the Braves. My son plays and he's having to make a big adjustment. He can hit the hard throwers (75ish mph) like a champ, but he flails at soft tossing kids. Point being, good off speed is hard to hit. The same thing would probably happen in the majors. Go back and watch some vintage Greg Maddux. Lots of fastballs, all moving in different directions, and insane command. He was never injured that I recall, and if he was, it was minor. He was an artist. People wonder why the Braves don't sign pitchers to long term deals. The answer? Because they're smart. The eye test tells us if a guy can throw 90-92 mph and hit 94 mph when he wants to reach back, he can throw the ball by major league hitters if he knows how to pitch. Keeping hitters off balance and making the pitches all look similar on their way to the plate is enough to throw hitters off and get smoked. The problem is there are not really many pitchers in the big leagues who are very smart anymore. Hell, they're not taught to "be smart"! They're sent to camps and to guys who specialize in teaching them to throw at maximum velocity, and the end result is physical damage......duh. There are very few guys who were "born" with 100 MPH stuff. Nolan Ryan, Vida Blue, JR Richard, and Roger Clemens all come to mind, and I'm not sure either of them threw 100. |
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Post by joeyg39 on Feb 22, 2023 13:02:59 GMT -5
Nolan Ryan was an absolute freak of nature. To throw as hard and as long as he did was beyond description. Threw a record 7 no hitters. 12 one hitters and 18 two hitters. Amazingly enough he never won a Cy Young award. He actually hit 85mph as a 63 year old... and reportedly hit 108mph as his fastest pitch. How's that? That arm belongs in the Smithsonian one day.
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Post by PABraveFan on Feb 22, 2023 18:54:53 GMT -5
I'm starting to think that we're never gonna get much from Soroka. It's always something. I hope I'm wrong (It could be worse. We could have signed him to a 7 year $245M contract  ) "Braves right-hander Michael Soroka is dealing with a sore hamstring that will prevent him from taking the mound for about a week and from appearing in spring games for a few weeks. “It’s a kick in the groin,” Soroka said to David O’Brien of The Athletic about the setback. “Pretty frustrating, especially given the early offseason for me, just to be able to get ready for this spring training. Then coming down with that was not fun. But that’s how it goes, and we’ll be moving forward here pretty shortly.” Soroka has been significantly impeded by injuries in recent years, with his 2020 cut short after three starts due to a torn right Achilles. The recovery has been quite arduous, involving three surgeries as he missed the past two seasons entirely. This latest issue doesn’t seem to be huge, but it’s understandably frustrating that there’s yet another hurdle to clear." |
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Post by joeyg39 on Feb 22, 2023 19:18:25 GMT -5
Rather have it be a sore hammy than a sore shoulder/elbow any day of the week. His muscles have to stretch out again after over two years of inactivity.
I remember getting back into ice hockey
which I played my whole life. I was inactive for 10 years. The next day after playing I couldn't get out of bed and could've used a wheel chair for the next 3 days. I was fifty then...Soroka's 25. He should be ok.
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Post by keystone61 on Feb 22, 2023 21:26:53 GMT -5
I don't know, man. Some guys are hurt all the time, and Soroka seems to be one of them. Is the hammy issue on the same leg as the Achilles injury?
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Post by Fumbduckery on Feb 22, 2023 21:42:49 GMT -5
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Post by PABraveFan on Feb 22, 2023 21:59:15 GMT -5
Soroka with two Achilles injuries then trying to come back last year has elbow soreness putting him out all of 2022 and now this. He's costing us $2.8M this year. He becomes a free agent in 2025 so two more years. He's only pitched 214 innings since he came up in 2018 and nothing since 2020.
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Post by joeyg39 on Feb 23, 2023 8:24:37 GMT -5
Acuña "bombs away" off of Max
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Post by wncbravesfan on Feb 23, 2023 9:54:18 GMT -5
Acuña "bombs away" off of Max Damn, he got every bit of that !!! |
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